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Suzuki 800 Intruder Club & Forum

A UK Site Dedicated To The Suzuki C800, VL800, VX800, M800, VZ800, VS800, C50, M50 Model Intruder / Boulevard / Marauder
 
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 removing the secondary throttle butterflies

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simbo
.. Mechanical Tart .. .. Site Moderator ..
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:56 pm

This is not a mod I've considered, But what's the opinion on removing the secondary throttle butterflies ? I know they do a good job at smoothing things out, but when you wind the throttle open they only open as much as the ECU tells them rather than having that control with the right hand like it used to be.
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captain crash
Mentally Deficient lunatic ..... & ..... Site Moderator
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PostSubject: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Mon Oct 15, 2012 6:06 pm

Oh dear, lost me. So far never read anyone doing any such mod on these bikes, would be interested to see what comes of this.
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simbo
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:46 pm

Me too Crash, I've read loads on this topic with one opinion cancelling the other out, but when you open the throttle I want to control what happens not a built in computer, maybe cancelling out Mr Suzuki with all his knowledge ? but if the bike came as standard without restrictive cats and air intake to please the pc brigade, and fitted with good exhausts and K&N's fitted as standard nobody would tamper with the perfect set up,
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captain crash
Mentally Deficient lunatic ..... & ..... Site Moderator
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Tue Oct 16, 2012 12:47 am

But isn't that what the aftermarket fuel processor is all about, putting the control of the bike back with the rider rather than with the bikes computer as it over rides it?
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simbo
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Tue Oct 16, 2012 8:32 pm

Yeah Crash, the fuel processor corrects the fuel ratio after adding after market air filters and exhaust otherwise it would run lean, But the secondary throttle valve would still only open as much as the ECU told it to until you reach full throttle when they would be wide open, When you wind the throttle open the primary valves open as far as you turn the throttle because they are controlled by the rider but the secondary only react as the ECU sees fit,
After reading more into it last night, it seems its more of a mod for tuned bikes, some say it gives instant throttle reaction and a slight 1% power increase on the dyno, but others say it makes standard bikes run lumpy and rough when cold ?
Once I fit a fuel processor, air filter and tre I'll give it a go and review it.
It's only four screws and easily reversible
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captain crash
Mentally Deficient lunatic ..... & ..... Site Moderator
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:35 am

Oh cool, glad its getting looked into in that way. I am sure plenty of riders will very much look forward to your findings however it turns out
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Mr Intruder
Suzuki800.com Founder ... & ... Senior Administrator
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:09 pm

I have been trying to get my head around this for the last few days & to be honest I am no closer to working out how the bike would react to the suggested modification now, than I was when I first read the post.
When we were only dealing with carburettors it was reasonably easy to work out the effects of changes made. However since moving over to fuel injection with computers and TPS sensors the dynamics have completely changed. For instance I can adjust the air/fuel ratio on my bike very easily, all I have to do is connect my bike up to the laptop and I can adjust the air and fuel at every point of the throttle position through the entire rev range. However as we now have computers that are operating & doing an excellent job of controlling how the bike reacts and responds under so many conditions, if we make adjustments to things such as the secondary butterfly we may find that the computer simply tries to rectify / reverse that modification until the point that it is told how it is now supposed to react.
Good luck with this mod and I look forward to your findings
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captain crash
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Thu Oct 18, 2012 1:12 am

I've been thinking about this and it makes sense that the bike would run ruff with that bit missing as I can remember reading a lot years ago about how bikes ride so much nicer with smooth air flow and from what Simbo has said it would seem they are there to smooth the flow. The thing is tho that by smoothing the flow that would obviously slow the flow which I guess is where you can gain the 1% power increase from but for me I would probably rather have a fluid throttle response than a lumpy one but you may well find that the lumpy response is so minor that the gain is worth the very limited change. The thing also to think about with this mod is what does 1% actually mean to a stage 3 bike such as Mr I rides or Simbo is planing and I work it out at less than 0.6 bhp on these bikes so as much as I am very interested to see what the actual result of this mod is in simbos opinion, I think that on these bikes you would get a bigger power increase by not eating your pudding for a few weeks
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Mr Intruder
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PostSubject: Re: removing the secondary throttle butterflies   Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:03 am

You really had me with you crash, until the last sentence where I just simply lost interest lol!
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